This is the full interview made by Jose Leseur, appearing in
French language in his Naninani-newsletter (firstname.lastname@example.org),
also extracts of it will be published soon in the next FEAR
DROP-issue (#9) in an article about Troum (email@example.com).
issue will also have a free compilation CD with a Troum-contribution.
1. You founded troum in 1997, just after the end of maeror tri.
is in your opinion the fundamental difference between the two projects?
think that with TROUM we work more focused, more conceptual, more composed,
M.T. had more improvisational elements in it, was more raw. It is interesting
to see that both "post"-MAEROR TRI follow-up-projects, 1000SCHOEN
and TROUM, are working more focused, more studio-technique-based. There
is more reflection on the compositions flowing into the music, whereas
with M.T. it was more chaotic, session-like. TROUM is like a "condensed"
and further developed version of M.T. maybe, like a child that has grown
up into a more mature being.
Troum is an old germanic terms which means « dream ». why did you choose
this name for your project ? does it means that one of your goal in
troum is to create a « transe », to push in another and subjective world
that doesnt exist in anyway ?
Why the dream instead of a more explicit political expression of your
subjectivity (i guess it is, isnt it)
its one of our aims to create a world outside from reality, to
create states of emotional trance.
dream is a symbol for us, it stands for the unconscious. Like the dream,
known to be the "main path to the unconscious", also music
is able to confront us with most inner & unconscious areas, here
you can feel a "direct touch" with it. So we think there are
many parallels between the music we do and dreams in general:
- both are symbolic
but non-verbal languages, who reveal a deeper meaning hidden behind
the phenomenal structure
- both can be seen
in regards to their relation to the human unconscious
- in our dreams and
inside music, everything is always in motion, there are no static
dreams (thus showing their dynamic and emotional quality)
- the effect dreams
have is a kind of mystery to us, as its the same with music
- you can listen to
new music in your dreams, as you can have dreamlike visions when you
listen to music
- both transcend reality
and may lead to a further understanding of the human "soul"
the dream has many different aspects, you can also see it as a wish
to change reality. We wouldnt say the dream has no political dimension:
The dream represents an inner world, but without dreams you cant
change the outer world. The music we do is based on a kind of dualism:
on one hand theres the wish to regress, the yearning to go back
to very early and basic states of existence (oceaning feelings, de-subjectivity),
on the other hand it has a "progressive" character, because
it expresses also the yearning to change reality into a more human place,
to show what could be. This is the "dialectics" of
such music, as it doesnt fit into todays reality.
Glit[s]ch: So the dream also stands for the rejection of todays
reality & the reflection on today society. The reality as we know
it is sharp & cold, so it is necessary to dream another reality,
one that is smooth, soft & warm.
You dont use any synthetisers or software. All sounds are created
by your hands (guitars, objects, effects
). Why ?
we are socialized with analogue equipment and are used to work with
them. But we also see advantages to use such equipment and not digital
stuff the production process is different if you touch the instruments
that create sound (not just "pushing buttons"). Theres
a greater variety to express emotions if you use instruments you can
play by hand, and also theres a specific about analogue created
sound we think.
4. How do you work your pieces ? Are they based on a precise idea,
a definited goal ?
different: sometimes we work with a precise idea or concept, sometimes
its more based on experimenting and improvisation "out of
the blue". If we work on a specific theme, the music is more constructed
5. Your music seems to describe an ancient lost world, runs along
a dark, gloomy and staired melancholic mood. The music seems to be only
these pure sensation. What are the aims that you want to reach with
troum ? Is it the vehicle to pass a precise philosophy (as your other
activities : « our music is our weapon », « non entertaining music »
is no distinct philosopy, but we see what you mean. This ancient archaic
lost world symbolizes perhaps the yearning for the things that have
gone (or that may come). You could say that our music is a tool to pass
not a precise philosopy but everyday life in all its strangeness.
It touches our whole existence.
TROUM we want to mirror the most inner emotions & contents, we want
to console, we want to sensitize the listeners. Music can be a precious
the end its music for the harmed or damaged souls of todays strange
6.You have began a trilogy called « tjukurrpa », a word that is
closely related to the australias arborigen culture and which
symbolize their ancestral animist world relation.
Why did you this choice. In your opinion, can the music a such back
to nature release ?
represents the link between certain music/songs & people & places
in aboriginal culture, thats what we liked about it... also it
means "dreamtime". People are linked through "Tjukurrpa"
through space & time, so to say.
us, it also means that you cant judge reality just by the phenomenas
you can see , its important to see the structure/meaning
behind it. Thats what you do when you try to find out the
effects of the unconscious on our daily behaviour & thinking.
doesnt mean to us that we have to go "back to nature".
We want to reveal the essence, the "core" of sound, thats
maybe a relation to your "back to nature"-idea. Tjukurrpa
is a nice idea, a reflection, a phantasy. It expresses a mythological
structure, but it also says: Reality as we know it IS NOT TRUE. It can
be changed (and we add: it should be changed). [for more infos
about Tjukurrpa, please check our website at www.troum.com
you think that the rules of creation processing changes with the society
in which the human lives ? Your music is in my opinion the prefect example
of an art which use technology to create a world that is managed by
the subjectivity of the listener
so a free world made of desires
and all faces , known and unknown, of the human spirit. What is your
position on this point ?
very good suggestion we think. Yes, the music should form a "free
world". The subjectivity should be supported. Theres no precise
definition or message in our music, its more an "emotional
ocean", one can see and gain many things out of it. Its amorph
music, it tends to dissolve.
one and nothing in life is one-dimensional and we love to create pieces
that form somehow schizophrenic emotions, so a lot of poissible ways
to go can be opened to the listeners.
You named the two first parts of the trilogy tjukurrpa « harmonies »
and « drones ». Why ?
It stands to reason that they are two characteristics of your music
that are inseparable. Even if the second part is maybe darkest, more
abstract & closed to an industrial aesthetic, it contains also a
lot of harmonies in the low tunes that you develop
the first part
is also very near a cold wave aesthetic, very melancholic but also melodic
and luminous (it reminds me some of the cure works - carnage visors
! - or sometimes eyeless in gaza, 4AD stuff)
the twos contains
some rythmical tentations
maybe « rythms » will be the last part
of the trilogy ?
Of course these elements are not totally seperable, but the music is
soundwise focused on the title it is related to. Usually these basic
elements (drone, harmonies, rhythms) are more mixed, we wanted to set
a focus on one of these elements for each CD. Yes, "rhythms"
or "pulsations" will be the last part of the trilogy.
What are the « drones », the « harmonies » represents for you ? They
are two characteristics that we find in the nature, without any human
treatments (even if yours are strictly humans !)
are not sure if you mean the sounds as basic elements, or the structure
of nature itself. In case you mean the sound, of course these are two
charasterics you find in sound or music, but we have our doubts if you
can find "harmonies" as such in nature its a
question of definition. Any sound in nature can be "harmonic"
if you enjoy it, but if you talk of harmonics as defined in classical
music, its different.
of TROUM, it was not our idea to represent basic "nature-elements"
in the music.
BarakaH: These basic elements of sound are for me more linked
to pre-natal psychoanalysis as these are the basic elements you
experience first as a fetus in your motherss womb: heartbeat (rhythms),
movements of womb-liquids (drones), mothers voice (harmonies).
As such they represent the base-characteristics of our later fascination
10.What is your relation to the time ?
troum pieces (as the previous maeror tri) seems to be based on meditation
(this way to strecht the time
). Like the spiral which is your
logo and that also representing a distortion of the time
The music pushes and pulls us out of time and therefore out of reality.
So take it as a drug that gives you a break from everyday-life. Or to
say it poetically: Time is the whiplash under which our (mental) back
is suffering. Society, especially economy is making our lives faster
and faster. Sometimes we even have time to think. So explore the slowlyness
of being !
I think our music is also the try to create a state of "timelessness"
itself ! Its a musical world without boundaries, an endless, timeless
world. Maybe a yearning of the time of being inside the womb of our
mothers (as said before), when the bounds of the self were not existing.
is a state where subjectivity ceases to exist, call it "de-subjectivation",
where also no other object exists: All is one and one is all. Everybody
knows it (at least knows how it feels with the body), but this
"knowledge" is buried deeply in our "body-selfs",
or unconscious areas.
its not just to slow down the time, its the wish to leave
behind time totally. Its an "endless" music, things
should not end at all! And theres also the sadness in it that
things always end.
11.You did some remixes from pieces of ultra milkmaids or kapotte
you approach this work ? What does the artist reworked represents for
is a challenge for us, to interprete the music of others that we like.
Its like musical alchemy, the transformation of musical ideas
into something new without totally loosing the old ground....
At last, could you give us a word about your projects in the near future
? do you have something to add, to precise
something you want
to say ?
next release should be the long-planned (we began with it in 1996!!)
collaboration work with YEN POX, which comes out as a CD on Malignant
theres a 10" named DARVE SH on Beta-Lactam Ring Records in
their 10"-series, which should be out in summer.
finished is a new CD-work called SIGQAN, to be released on Relapse/Release
Records hopefully soon.. the track we choosed for this FEAR DROP
compilation is an outtake from the SIGQAN-recordings.
course, there will be also the third part of the TJUKURRPA-trilogy on
our own label Transgredient Records, later this year or early next year.
other projects are in the making or discussion-phase, for which we dont
have titles yet.
Music has saved our life, we are sure.... its the basic swamp
that formed our little beings.. "From
the deepness of DRONES we
raised, the PULSATIONS pushed us up to higher states, where HARMONIES
welcomed us". (just